The Original Thread

[NEPIC]

Here is something I spent a whole day on but I think I got only half way through. This is my first attempt using Skypesos.

I need 4 seats in economy. I am in PHX but I can start/end in LAX. 2 weeks trip in June '15. One week in AMS (stop over) and another in ZAG (destination).

I was able to find BOS-AMS (June 3) and AMS-ZAG (June 10) at saver levels, but nothing coming back around June 17-20, and I am sure b/c I dont know the tricks. I can see availability from LHR-LAX on VS but want to avoid taxes*4 and still have to find something from ZAG to LHR on ST.

Please someone help get me that delta stopover before 12/31 !!!!

If you have ZAG-(ST Hub)-LHR-LAX on one ticket you will avoid the APD (>$100 in Y), though you will still have to pay the Airport Passenger Service fee (~$50). So if there's availability there on VS you should be able to make it work relatively cheaply.

4 tickets are generally pretty tough to find together. Is splitting up into 2/2 an option? Some of the initial posts in this thread covered a few cases like this.

 

[Brennan]

I booked a quick trip to Abu Dhabi during the great sale on Christmas...now I'm thinking I'd like to extend it.

I'm flying JFK-AUH on 2/9 and am thinking about throwing away the return on the 12th and booking a return with miles in 1st or biz. Is there a way to do this with a stopover in Europe?

I'm thinking about using Alaska miles specifically, however, have decent balances on most major US airlines. Any advice or recommended routings would be greatly appreciated!

 

[NEPIC]

I booked a quick trip to Abu Dhabi during the great sale on Christmas...now I'm thinking I'd like to extend it.

I'm flying JFK-AUH on 2/9 and am thinking about throwing away the return on the 12th and booking a return with miles in 1st or biz. Is there a way to do this with a stopover in Europe?

I'm thinking about using Alaska miles specifically, however, have decent balances on most major US airlines. Any advice or recommended routings would be greatly appreciated!

With AS you should be able to build in a stopover in Europe, but the tricky part is you have to keep to the same airline on both legs. So you could have stopovers in LHR (BA), AMS (KL), CDG (AF) or EK (MXP). The BA option would sadly attract sizable surcharges, and the APD ex-LHR. There did appear to be some availability on EK and AF though.

Otherwise you are really left with a <24 hours layover, or two separate awards. Using two awards with AA, a Middle East-Europe award is 30k in J (and can use Etihad), and so would come to 80k total back to the US (if you can find Oneworld space from Europe). Not much more than the 72.5k AS charges for EK. UA is also decent from the Middle East to Europe at 35k in J with perhaps more flexibility to connect to where you want to go from FRA.

ETA: If you wait till post 1/1 you should be able to book a oneway Skymiles award CDG/AMS-LHR-JFK award on AF/KL and VS. As I mentioned above a little, this will mean you don't get the APD charged on a connecting itinerary (<24 hours) and no fuel surcharges on VS. The only caveat is that the ex-EU originating fee on DL awards may still be charged.

 

[Brennan]

Thanks! 2 separate awards on AA seems like my best bet for flexibility...AS is not giving me as many options as I'd like.

 

[smittytabb]

As a data point from another blog I happened to check today, Mr Schlappig apparently managed to change an AA award 55 minutes before departure... so I guess there's a great deal of flexibility there if you want to take the chance!

I've rebooked closer to take off than that. I, like Lucky, am AA EXP, and what I don't know is if that factors into the equation or not. It costs us nothing.

 

[hsinaz]

If you have ZAG-(ST Hub)-LHR-LAX on one ticket you will avoid the APD (>$100 in Y), though you will still have to pay the Airport Passenger Service fee (~$50). So if there's availability there on VS you should be able to make it work relatively cheaply.

4 tickets are generally pretty tough to find together. Is splitting up into 2/2 an option? Some of the initial posts in this thread covered a few cases like this.

Thanks NEPIC...
Update: Things were getting tight on 30th with 1 day left for getting SO. I was able to give up on going to Europe when I found 4 biz seats at a time on KE going to/fro LAX-ICN. I booked those without phone fee since they were pricing higher than 140K each. Then later I added PHX-LAX and LAX-PHX economy connections. And then came the longest (I think the call lasted about 2 hours) call, I was able to add a stop in ICN with ICN-DPS-ICN connecting back to the earlier ICN-LAX-PHX. Could not find any biz seats on these.

All in all PHX(biz*1/Econ*3)-LAX-(biz*4)ICN(stop)(econ*4)-DPS(dest)(econ*4)-ICN(biz*4)-LAX(first*4)-PHX for 140K + $100 each. We might be able to stand by for first PHX-LAX if available.

I don't know if nobody goes to Seoul in July is the reason why I found 4 biz tickets together but my and family would be happy to experience biz class for the first time

 

[amk522]

General question about booking Alitalia awards. I know they charge YQ and recently made changes to their award chart, but they still have some decent deals. My one fear is the following text in their T&C

• Can I book award ticket with Transfer Miles?
  When booking an award, 25% of the miles required for an award must be earned miles with Alitalia or MilleMiglia Partners. Buy,Gift or Transfer miles can be used for a maximum of 75% of the miles required for any requested award. For example redeem for a 40,000 miles award and use 30,000 Buy, Gift or Transfer miles and 10,000 earned miles.

Is that enforced? This basically makes the Amex partnership a non-starter for everyone in the US who doesn't credit Sky Team flights to AZ. Anyone have experience, please chime in. This has been a major deterrent for me.

 

[NEPIC]

General question about booking Alitalia awards. I know they charge YQ and recently made changes to their award chart, but they still have some decent deals. My one fear is the following text in their T&C

• Can I book award ticket with Transfer Miles?
  When booking an award, 25% of the miles required for an award must be earned miles with Alitalia or MilleMiglia Partners. Buy,Gift or Transfer miles can be used for a maximum of 75% of the miles required for any requested award. For example redeem for a 40,000 miles award and use 30,000 Buy, Gift or Transfer miles and 10,000 earned miles.

Is that enforced? This basically makes the Amex partnership a non-starter for everyone in the US who doesn't credit Sky Team flights to AZ. Anyone have experience, please chime in. This has been a major deterrent for me.

From a 3/13/2013 VFTW post in the comments, it is assumed that requirement applies to transfers within Alitalia's program - i.e. from person to person - not transfers in from Amex. I'm not sure from reading whether Gary had actually booked an award in this manner, but I'd be willing to assume you would be fine.

 

[Wings]

Could use some help getting my parents to MAN. I was able to secure a return flight MAN-ORD-BNA on AA, but can't get one going over. Coming home there were several options connecting through PHL, but none are showing on the Outbound (even using AAnytime). I have miles in virtually every program (or can get them via UR/MR). Trying to get BNA-MAN on 4/17 or 4/18, preferably 1 connection and not on BA(or other high tax/fee route). Thanks for any tips!

Edited to add that Y is fine

 

[NEPIC]

Could use some help getting my parents to MAN. I was able to secure a return flight MAN-ORD-BNA on AA, but can't get one going over. Coming home there were several options connecting through PHL, but none are showing on the Outbound (even using AAnytime). I have miles in virtually every program (or can get them via UR/MR). Trying to get BNA-MAN on 4/17 or 4/18, preferably 1 connection and not on BA(or other high tax/fee route). Thanks for any tips!

Edited to add that Y is fine

The other one-stop possibilities would be MCO or ATL on VS (via DL) or IAD or EWR on UA. It seems to be one of those times where Y availability isn't great though. VS has Upper Class availability on 4/18 and is a decent deal at 62.5k DL miles with no surcharges. I'm going to go out on a limb and say DL won't offer any low level award availability on the BNA connection, but maybe you can find a way to make it work.

Flying into LHR and using the train to MAN (or separate BA award) would open up a lot more possibilities. Booked in advance the trains can be reasonably priced.

 

[hsinaz]

Could use some help getting my parents to MAN. I was able to secure a return flight MAN-ORD-BNA on AA, but can't get one going over. Coming home there were several options connecting through PHL, but none are showing on the Outbound (even using AAnytime). I have miles in virtually every program (or can get them via UR/MR). Trying to get BNA-MAN on 4/17 or 4/18, preferably 1 connection and not on BA(or other high tax/fee route). Thanks for any tips!

Edited to add that Y is fine

If you had a bunch of Skypesos to burn, then I think you could have them fly first/biz using DL/VS on 4/18 as: BNA-ATL in first on DL1676 2:30PM-4:42PM and ATL-MAN in biz on VS110 7:10PM-8:20AM(nd) for 62,500 skypesos each and very few taxes. You may have to be quick since the BNA-ATL only has 3 F seats left.

 

[NEPIC]

If you had a bunch of Skypesos to burn, then I think you could have them fly first/biz using DL/VS on 4/18 as: BNA-ATL in first on DL1676 2:30PM-4:42PM and ATL-MAN in biz on VS110 7:10PM-8:20AM(nd) for 62,500 skypesos each and very few taxes. You may have to be quick since the BNA-ATL only has 3 F seats left.

Unfortunately the connecting flight there is not low-level F, so will price additively (at 95k). You need the 25k or R class availability on the domestic segment.

There is a low level coach availability on an early flight though giving a rather lengthy layover.

 

[Wings]

Thanks for the tips, I'll explore the VS routes didn't know about those (though I don't want to burn that many miles if I can score a 20K ticket on via AA offpeak)

 

[amk522]

From a 3/13/2013 VFTW post in the comments, it is assumed that requirement applies to transfers within Alitalia's program - i.e. from person to person - not transfers in from Amex. I'm not sure from reading whether Gary had actually booked an award in this manner, but I'd be willing to assume you would be fine.

Thanks for taking a look. If anyone else knows definitively it would be appreciated if you chimed in. When Loyalty Lobby shares the details of the Milemiglia Buy miles promotions he always warns about that 75% rule so I am not sure what to believe. I can imagine that for transferring MR it should be OK or people would be up in arms with AMEX, because there's no way 90% of the people read the fine print.

 

[NEPIC]

Thanks for taking a look. If anyone else knows definitively it would be appreciated if you chimed in. When Loyalty Lobby shares the details of the Milemiglia Buy miles promotions he always warns about that 75% rule so I am not sure what to believe. I can imagine that for transferring MR it should be OK or people would be up in arms with AMEX, because there's no way 90% of the people read the fine print.

Thanks for the data point from Loyalty Lobby - I had not come across that. I would honestly be pretty surprised if Alitalia's systems are smart enough to figure all those details out, given what I have seen of their website! I would tend to agree with that assessment of the Amex situation...but I wonder how many transfers are actually made to Alitalia?

 

[hsinaz]

Thanks for the tips, I'll explore the VS routes didn't know about those (though I don't want to burn that many miles if I can score a 20K ticket on via AA offpeak)

For now those are only possible from 4/22 or 4/23 onwards..

 

[hsinaz]

For now those are only possible from 4/22 or 4/23 onwards..

Also found another one for 4/21. BNA-PHL-MAN at 20K using AA miles on US air flights. Hopefully your plans can be flexible a few days.

 

[Haley]

looking for flight home (AUS) from FCO. In late July, 28 or 29 27 if I need to (I know!)
2 in business
AA shows availability on FCO-JFK-YYZ
But it will not show just the FCO-JFK flt alone (or in a combo that actually gets me home).

Questions, if I book the YYZ then pay $150 change fee would that work? Alternate plan, if I call in and point out the FCO-JFK leg on the way to YYZ will they let me book it? Alternate 3, would I be able to ditch the last leg (never flown through US on way to Canada from Europe before, would I need to clear US customs or just Canadian)?

All seats to US have about $450 higher fees (and go through LHR and cost 85k miles more). No forward cabin saVVer seats on any date.

YYZ flight has my SaVVer seats.

Plan 4- give up, go to YYZ book second ticket from there home. Still significantly fewer miles and $$$. 50k under $150 fees plus 12.5 or 25k to get from YYZ-AUS (with DFW-AUS being the hardest leg to find, as always)

I have miles in a few other programs but would rather burn my AA stash.

I want to pull the trigger on the FCO outbound ASAP. Ideas?

 

[NEPIC]

looking for flight home (AUS) from FCO. In late July, 28 or 29 27 if I need to (I know!)
2 in business
AA shows availability on FCO-JFK-YYZ
But it will not show just the FCO-JFK flt alone (or in a combo that actually gets me home).

Questions, if I book the YYZ then pay $150 change fee would that work? Alternate plan, if I call in and point out the FCO-JFK leg on the way to YYZ will they let me book it? Alternate 3, would I be able to ditch the last leg (never flown through US on way to Canada from Europe before, would I need to clear US customs or just Canadian)?

All seats to US have about $450 higher fees (and go through LHR and cost 85k miles more). No forward cabin saVVer seats on any date.

YYZ flight has my SaVVer seats.

Plan 4- give up, go to YYZ book second ticket from there home. Still significantly fewer miles and $$$. 50k under $150 fees plus 12.5 or 25k to get from YYZ-AUS (with DFW-AUS being the hardest leg to find, as always)

I have miles in a few other programs but would rather burn my AA stash.

I want to pull the trigger on the FCO outbound ASAP. Ideas?

I'd put the YYZ award on hold, call AA up and get them to change the last segment. No harm in trying.

I have not seen AA releasing married segments before - interesting if this is the case rather than a website issue.

 

[Mountain Trader]

I'd put the YYZ award on hold, call AA up and get them to change the last segment. No harm in trying.

I have not seen AA releasing married segments before - interesting if this is the case rather than a website issue.

Good answer. I too have not seen AA releasing married segments, but the "hold/call" method is worth the time to try.

 

[NEPIC]

Good answer. I too have not seen AA releasing married segments, but the "hold/call" method is worth the time to try.

I certainly hope the married segment logic is not a recent enhancement!

So I see the same thing on Aug 2 for LHR-ORD on AA99. YYZ works as destination, but ORD does not. Curious.

@Haley - let us know what you find out if you call.

 

[Mountain Trader]

Married segments on AA have been around a long time. They get a lot of mention on Flyer Talk in the thread on award availability. I haven't read that thread in a year or so but I would check there it I were looking for a workaround.

 

[Haley]

One seat went away.
I do have a hold on the other one, we can split up. Might be just fine after 10 days together
New question.
Will BA not show flights if you don't have enough points in the account?
I'm getting errors and wonder if that is it (could also be I'm on my phone checking, not ideal)

 

[NEPIC]

Married segments on AA have been around a long time. They get a lot of mention on Flyer Talk in the thread on award availability. I haven't read that thread in a year or so but I would check there it I were looking for a workaround.

Thanks for that - I had just never come across them or come across the FT thread. Guess I will add that to the list of things to amuse myself one of these days!

One seat went away.
I do have a hold on the other one, we can split up. Might be just fine after 10 days together
New question.
Will BA not show flights if you don't have enough points in the account?
I'm getting errors and wonder if that is it (could also be I'm on my phone checking, not ideal)

They will show fine. BA is just temperamental. Try logging in/out or starting from a recent search link.

 

[Haley]

Thanks.
BA site is working again.
Still not finding 2 saVVer (except out of LHR) anytime out of anywhere in Europe to anywhere in N.America. Found way there in minutes.

 

[amk522]

Calling AA is definitely advised, but the other option which is completely up to you to decide if you are comfortable with, would be to just skip the last leg. All airlines will have to offload your bags when you land in the US to declare customs. The NYC-YYZ leg would be a throwaway ticket.

 

[Haley]

Calling AA is definitely advised, but the other option which is completely up to you to decide if you are comfortable with, would be to just skip the last leg. All airlines will have to offload your bags when you land in the US to declare customs. The NYC-YYZ leg would be a throwaway ticket.

Thanks, that was what I thought but wasn't 100% sure.

 

[Matt]

Due to the popularity of this thread and demand I've opened up a sub forum here for Award Booking Help. You can start out new threads with your questions.

 

[nickelfish1]

So you have the miles, now what? Ask away, as specifically as possible. Whether it's tweaking an itinerary to get more value or starting from scratch, two heads are better than one

OK......I'm asking...plus, I can't find the sub-forum to ask!

I'm trying to book NYC-LHR as cheaply as possible. Right now, I have four tickets on hold for 300k miles and $778. It's killing me to use 300k since that nearly wipes out my points. If I can book HPN-PHL-LHR it brings it down to 240k. I was able to book two tickets. I've called US and AA and asked about opening two more award spots for that route and they said they can't. All I really need is two spots on the HPN-PHL becuase I was able to put a hold on two tickets PHL-LHR. I thought...let me see about Avios. One way, cheaper mile points. The higher level saver award is available on US (20k pts) but, I can't see it on BA at all. I called and BA said they couldn't book it for me. (I've yet to transfer the pts into BA I was hoping they could just hold it for me maybe that's the problem?) Does anyone know how to get around this?
It would be HPN-PHL USAir # 4757 5:50 pm on Aug 25th.

 

[NEPIC]

OK......I'm asking...plus, I can't find the sub-forum to ask!

I'm trying to book NYC-LHR as cheaply as possible. Right now, I have four tickets on hold for 300k miles and $778. It's killing me to use 300k since that nearly wipes out my points. If I can book HPN-PHL-LHR it brings it down to 260k. I was able to book two tickets. I've called US and AA and asked about opening two more award spots for that route and they said they can't. All I really need is two spots on the HPN-PHL becuase I was able to put a hold on two tickets PHL-LHR. I thought...let me see about Avios. One way, cheaper mile points. The higher level saver award is available on US (20k pts) but, I can't see it on BA at all. I called and BA said they couldn't book it for me. (I've yet to transfer the pts into BA I was hoping they could just hold it for me maybe that's the problem?) Does anyone know how to get around this?
It would be HPN-PHL USAir # 4757 5:50 pm on Aug 25th.

If I'm understanding correctly, the problem is that BA only has access to the low level award space on US (AA), so BA won't help in this case. All you can do is hope low level award space on your desired HPN-PHL flight opens up, or look at alternate area airports that may have low level award space.

 

[Road Humps]

If I'm understanding correctly, the problem is that BA only has access to the low level award space on US (AA), so BA won't help in this case. All you can do is hope low level award space on your desired HPN-PHL flight opens up, or look at alternate area airports that may have low level award space.

Or just buy that leg -- maybe offset using Amex credits (if you have them). I had to do this a month or so ago in for ORD-LGA in order to connect up with SQ JFK-FRA. I just bought tickets and offset the cost using my Amex $200. I wouldn't let a domestic leg stand in your way, the hard part is usually getting the transatlantic seats.

 

[nickelfish1]

I think that's the problem. I thought BA could get access to the higher lower level economy space ... so instead of using 20k AA I could use 7500 Avios.

I feel like there are better ways to burn 300k than roundtrip to London. Those extra 60k miles kinda mean a lot to me.
We aren't really fixed on LHR. I'm trying to get to Europe without the high fuel charges. We're open to most destinations and LHR just happened to be the one spot I found. Ughhhhh!

 

[nickelfish1]

Or just buy that leg

Already checked it out. Tickets were over $450 each.

 

[nickelfish1]

One more question(s)

Tickets are on hold for:

JFK-LHR

My return date is Sept 4th. Can I make JFK a stop over and continue on to MIA in Nov on an AA award ticket?

If so, I have to call them to do this?

 

[smittytabb]

One more question(s)

Tickets are on hold for:

JFK-LHR

My return date is Sept 4th. Can I make JFK a stop over and continue on to MIA in Nov on an AA award ticket?

If so, I have to call them to do this?

AA recently took away stopovers on Award Tickets.