Keeping the Arrival+? (vs. Downgrade)

[ed1chandler]

Hand in hand with the discussion of understanding how Arrival+ redemption works, I'm about to do the math on keeping the Arrival+ vs downgrading (or cancelling) it.

Off the top of my head, the downgrade would mean:

• 2x points only on travel and dining (as opposed to everything).
• No annual fee (vs $89)
• No chip-and-signature-that-likes-to-think-it's-chip-and-PIN.
• No free TripitPro
• Perhaps some incidental differences between being a "World" MasterCard and just a "normal" one.

Anything else I need to consider while I start doing the math?

 

[Bret Bourgeois]

Few times I would say, don't think just keep.

Some thoughts regarding the Arrival card.

* Simon Mall. I can buy $15,000 for $15,075. After you redeem you get the 10% bonus. $331.65- $75(fees) = $256.65 minus liquidation. That could range from free (BB), to .70 per thousand for Money Orders, to $1.50 per $2000 for Bill Pay.

* Portals to purchase Amex GC. In addition to the 2-4% you get back via the portal. I take the $5000 and liquidate at RA for fee free GD's.

* My credit limit is $16,000 but know of people who have same limit and do 2-3 that much a month.

* I have used it for rental cars, luggage fees, taxes and hotel room charges. Anything that is coded as travel. An example, this past weekend my wife and I got away, I used SPG points for the room. I chose to valet and we ordered a couple of things and had them put it on our hotel bill. I paid with the Arrival card and today, used miles to take the charges off. The reason we chose to stay at the Firesky in Phoenix is I will just use this card to pay for 3 nights rather than finding something cheaper a little further away. More of a " we have the points why not?"

* Once the charge hits your card you have 120 days to redeem your miles.

* Barclays Boost portal. Granted that is not available but I ordered $30,000 over a couple months and racked up the miles. If it comes back, take advantage.

* Its another tool in your MS bag. Diversification. It's not Chase or Citi. You don't have to hit it hard but when the opportunity comes take it out and use it.

* Barclays doesn't have many options.

* You have it, I certainly would not close it.

You have to run the numbers that make sense to you. My go to cards are
Amex 5%
Fidelity 2%
Arrival

I am sure others could point out more benefits.

 

[ed1chandler]

Well, that's my inclination too, but this place is all about sharing ideas ... which sort-of requires thinking.
The chip-and-PIN thing didn't work worth a crap for me while I was overseas last month, so I'm less enamored on that account.

 

[Bret Bourgeois]

Few times I would say, don't think just keep.

Some thoughts regarding the Arrival card.

* Simon Mall. I can buy $15,000 for $15,075. After you redeem you get the 10% bonus. $331.65- $75(fees) = $256.65 minus liquidation. That could range from free (BB), to .70 per thousand for Money Orders, to $1.50 per $2000 for Bill Pay.

* Portals to purchase Amex GC. In addition to the 2-4% you get back via the portal. I take the $5000 and liquidate at RA for fee free GD's.

* My credit limit is $16,000 but know of people who have same limit and do 2-3 that much a month.

* I have used it for rental cars, luggage fees, taxes and hotel room charges. Anything that is coded as travel. An example, this past weekend my wife and I got away, I used SPG points for the room. I chose to valet and we ordered a couple of things and had them put it on our hotel bill. I paid with the Arrival card and today, used miles to take the charges off. The reason we chose to stay at the Firesky in Phoenix is I will just use this card to pay for 3 nights rather than finding something cheaper a little further away. More of a " we have the points why not?"

* Once the charge hits your card you have 120 days to redeem your miles.

* Barclays Boost portal. Granted that is not available but I ordered $30,000 over a couple months and racked up the miles. If it comes back, take advantage.

* Its another tool in your MS bag. Diversification. It's not Chase or Citi. You don't have to hit it hard but when the opportunity comes take it out and use it.

* Barclays doesn't have many options.

* You have it, I certainly would not close it.

You have to run the numbers that make sense to you. My go to cards are
Amex 5%
Fidelity 2%
Arrival

I am sure others could point out more benefits.

 

[Haley]

I'm inclined to say keep.

If your 2% cash back option is an AmEx, even more so. It gives you a 2x card anywhere that would be a 1x spend, even if they do not accept AmEx. It fills a need in my wallet for that reason.

 

[dlin]

i'm going to downgrade this fall. the 2.2% cb doesn't outweigh the $89 fee when compared to the fee-free fidelity. almost everything that can be done on the barclays can be done on the fidelity. my other issue is i don't travel enough to redeem barclays for travel. with fidelity, i just take the cash. it really depends on your habits

 

[Voyaging Doc]

I've read the great Saverocity posts on 2% Fidelity vs annual-fee Barclay. I must say 2.2% is a damn good deal for a non-amex card. Plus, if amex locks you in at 4 cards you're limiting your options. $89 is nothing but if you do some MSing it pays for the fee and offers you great flexibility, so I am personally inclined to keep it. That's not to say I won't try for a retention fee, but this card is one of the cards I would pay an annual fee for that doesn't offer an annual bonus (like marriott, hyatt).

Cash is certainly king. In my mind I'm more comforted that the IRS will more likely see the barclay points as a rebate and not an income when compared to the fidelity. In addition, there are various tricks you can use to get cash then "force" yourself to travel to redeem. You can do the buy, redeem, and refund trick. I think most do at least $1000 in travel expenses annually though assuming you generate 100,000 in points ($50k spend).

 

[Sesq]

Haven't people been able to get half off the fee with a call to retentions?

I have the Fid Visa (1.5% on the first 15K, 2% thereafter, so essentially a pay as you go $75 AF (15K * 0.5%)) and the Cap One Venture ($59 AF, I hear fee waivers are scarce so probably downgrade) as 2% alternatives. I am likely to only keep the Arrivals+ with the fee reduction.

 

[dlin]

i've spent quite a bit on my arrival but they didn't offer to waive my annual fee or my wife's. if the amex GC boost portal 4% comes back i'll be happy to upgrade again to the fee version.

 

[smittytabb]

I've read the great Saverocity posts on 2% Fidelity vs annual-fee Barclay. I must say 2.2% is a damn good deal for a non-amex card. Plus, if amex locks you in at 4 cards you're limiting your options. $89 is nothing but if you do some MSing it pays for the fee and offers you great flexibility, so I am personally inclined to keep it. That's not to say I won't try for a retention fee, but this card is one of the cards I would pay an annual fee for that doesn't offer an annual bonus (like marriott, hyatt).

Cash is certainly king. In my mind I'm more comforted that the IRS will more likely see the barclay points as a rebate and not an income when compared to the fidelity. In addition, there are various tricks you can use to get cash then "force" yourself to travel to redeem. You can do the buy, redeem, and refund trick. I think most do at least $1000 in travel expenses annually though assuming you generate 100,000 in points ($50k spend).

My understanding is that the "4 cards" amex "locks you into" are AMEX cards issued by them. There are some cards out there issued by other banks and entities such as Wells Fargo and Fidelity that would not count as one of your four. The way to see if a card is issued by AMEX is to check their own site. It lists several categories such as "prepaid", "small business" and "personal". Here is the list of personal cards https://www304.americanexpress.com/credit-card/compare?sj_tabToOpen=3&inav=menu_cards_pc_viewallcards

 

[Haley]

My understanding is that the "4 cards" amex "locks you into" are AMEX cards issued by them. There are some cards out there issued by other banks and entities such as Wells Fargo and Fidelity that would not count as one of your four.

This is correct, also it is four credit cards. Charge cards and prepaid cards do not count against that limit.

 

[smittytabb]

This is correct, also it is four credit cards. Charge cards and prepaid cards do not count against that limit.

Yes, that's an excellent distinction. Thanks for pointing that out.

 

[augustus23]

i've spent quite a bit on my arrival but they didn't offer to waive my annual fee or my wife's. if the amex GC boost portal 4% comes back i'll be happy to upgrade again to the fee version.

Do you mind sharing how much you spent? "Quite a bit" can mean different things to different people. I've read of people getting waived annual fees at $30,000 spend/year.

 

[dlin]

between $20-$25k on both mine and my wife's for the past 12 months. maybe not enough to get the fee waived or maybe i just didn't get the right csr. i have read a lot of people getting retention offers so i've bummed. i'm trying to push through as much as possible in the next 2 months before i downgrade. i'm at $7k this month haha

 

[augustus23]

between $20-$25k on both mine and my wife's for the past 12 months. maybe not enough to get the fee waived or maybe i just didn't get the right csr. i have read a lot of people getting retention offers so i've bummed. i'm trying to push through as much as possible in the next 2 months before i downgrade. i'm at $7k this month haha

You know what they say - hang up and try again!

 

[ed1chandler]

I have the Fid Visa (1.5% on the first 15K, 2% thereafter, so essentially a pay as you go $75 AF (15K * 0.5%)) ...

This is a fresh and interesting way to think of it. Thanks.

 

[Spgbus]

...Anything else I need to consider while I start doing the math?

I called Barclay customer support line to ask for AF waiver and being granted with a praise on how great I had been a loyal customer.

 

[dlin]

i gotta call again then...been rejected 4 times already haha

 

[Annie H.]

I'm used to charges hanging for a week at Citi in temp auth but I haven't used my Arrival in a bit and have forgotten how they do it. I have a charge from last Tuesday that is still hanging in temp auth. It's a largish sum and I'd like to pay it down before the month closes on 9/21. Barclay is really skitish about taking payments that will take an account negative and I don't want to do that. I have it set up for a BP on 9/20-- any advice or data points?

 

[Sooner]

I'm used to charges hanging for a week at Citi in temp auth but I haven't used my Arrival in a bit and have forgotten how they do it. I have a charge from last Tuesday that is still hanging in temp auth. It's a largish sum and I'd like to pay it down before the month closes on 9/21. Barclay is really skitish about taking payments that will take an account negative and I don't want to do that. I have it set up for a BP on 9/20-- any advice or data points?

I was able at least once to make a payment of the balance owing, and immediately make another payment of the same amount again, apparently before the system recognized it as already paid.

 

[penncomm]

Arrival is a keeper for me. My most utilized card. I don't blink at the $89 annual fee. The 10% redemption rebate is sweet. And the Barclay shopping portal often has some great offers, which stack on top of the 2x for using the card. This is the card that I give my wife to use whenever/wherever so she doesn't have to be "play" the credit card shuffle game.

 

[kissmyjazz]

Does someone know what happens to the accumulated points balance if I downgrade? I have about 40,000 points accumulated but have no travel expenses to redeem them

 

[Spgbus]

Does someone know what happens to the accumulated points balance if I downgrade? I have about 40,000 points accumulated but have no travel expenses to redeem them

MS travel expense

 

[Annie H.]

MS travel expense

As a newer member you might not know we don't speak "FT" here but rather try to help each other and aren't afraid of sharing. It might be helpful to the OP if you could give some examples of how to MS travel expense.

 

[KennyBSAT]

Does someone know what happens to the accumulated points balance if I downgrade? I have about 40,000 points accumulated but have no travel expenses to redeem them

Have you called to inquire about cancelling? There's a good chance you'll get the fee waived. If they don't waive the fee, just book a $400+ refundable hotel room, and another $40+ one, redeem the points for the more expensive one and then for the cheap one, and cancel the rooms. This may be a bad idea if done repeatedly, but once or twice won't cause any problem.

 

[Spgbus]

As a newer member you might not know we don't speak "FT" here but rather try to help each other and aren't afraid of sharing. It might be helpful to the OP if you could give some examples of how to MS travel expense.

Interesting... Isn't the Level II content caused by the 'afraid of sharing'? At least FT has flat level content.

 

[Annie H.]

Interesting... Isn't the Level II content caused by the 'afraid of sharing'? At least FT has flat level content.

I'm really not trying to be snarky or a smart ass and I'm sorry if I gave that impression. I was just trying to encourage you to be more specific to help the OP. FT does NOT have flat level content although it appears that way (if I'm using the terminology right). Lots of old-timers don't post anymore and I've heard--- pssst-- there are "secret" threads there but can't confirm.

Matt has a nice post: http://saverocity.com/travel/kihon
that inspired me to start this thread:
http://saverocity.com/forum/threads/crowdsourcing-spoonfeed-level-2-5.1061/

We have all different levels of folks here 1.0 to 10 plus and the main thing we have in common is our friendliness and willingness to help each other.

 

[Spgbus]

I'm really not trying to be snarky or a smart ass and I'm sorry if I gave that impression. I was just trying to encourage you to be more specific to help the OP. FT does NOT have flat level content although it appears that way (if I'm using the terminology right). Lots of old-timers don't post anymore and I've heard--- pssst-- there are "secret" threads there but can't confirm.

Matt has a nice post: http://saverocity.com/travel/kihon
that inspired me to start this thread:
http://saverocity.com/forum/threads/crowdsourcing-spoonfeed-level-2-5.1061/

We have all different levels of folks here 1.0 to 10 plus and the main thing we have in common is our friendliness and willingness to help each other.

Fair points. We are all kind here to help each other. Anyway, I am getting an error when clicking your 2nd link:
You do not have permission to view this page or perform this action.

 

[Annie H.]

Fair points. We are all kind here to help each other. Anyway, I am getting an error when clicking your 2nd link:
You do not have permission to view this page or perform this action.

Oops-- that's Level 2 (for a moment I thought I was on another forum). Sorry about that. Folks sharing their ideas about whether or not we should have Level 3. There are rumors here that Level 2 isn't too hard to achieve.

 

[James from BNA]

Sorry, I'm late to the party on this thread. Has OP considered cancelling before AF and getting another Arrival card 6 months later?

I'm not certain this can be done, but it worked for me for US Air, Choice, Frontier, Hawaiian, and Travelocity. I have 6 Barclays cards open at the moment. I might try it with Arrival once I've had it a little longer. Any data points on 2nd Arrival?

If you are a high volume MS'er on the Arrival you could make far more than 40k points in 6 months, or even 1 month. And no guarantee of re-approval.

 

[MickiSue]

FWIW, we just got Arrival + and are planning to do a lot of the spend on it. Miles can be downgraded, or difficult to impossible to redeem. But cash is cash is cash.

We don't have Fidelity accounts, and would rather pay the $89 or a fraction thereof in a year than to pay the higher trading costs VS where we currently trade.

 

[James from BNA]

FWIW, we just got Arrival + and are planning to do a lot of the spend on it. Miles can be downgraded, or difficult to impossible to redeem. But cash is cash is cash.

Unless your cash is from Venezuela.

 

[MickiSue]

Unless your cash is from Venezuela.

Aren't I the lucky one! It's not!

 

[Jack]

Has OP considered cancelling before AF and getting another Arrival card 6 months later?

I'm not certain this can be done, but it worked for me for US Air, Choice, Frontier, Hawaiian, and Travelocity. I have 6 Barclays cards open at the moment. I might try it with Arrival once I've had it a little longer. Any data points on 2nd Arrival?.

I'm curious about this too. I have one more month before my annul fee hits. My main spend these days is on OBC and I also have the Fidelity AMEX so I have been pondering closing the Arrival and then seeing if I can get it again after a few months with another 40K bonus.

 

[Jasonchen]

Can this card be converted to other product , like the upromising card?